if the universe is finite what is beyond it

The observable universe spans a 93 billion light-years diameter if we take Earth as a central point of measurement. Cosmology - Cosmology - Finite or infinite? Think of the universe as the surface of a sphere. Therefore, it became sort of a common practice to refer to the “observable universe,” that is made of “physical matter,” when speaking of the universe, and that it is “finite.”. Infinity may exist in a greater reality that has given rise to our universe. This is just another reason to believe that the universe has expanded, even beyond our exploration capabilities. After the initial explosion, it continued to grow and to expand for a while. A rational answer to these questions is that there is something beyond the material universe — a creator, an unlimited being that shares of itself … I was just thinking recently that since the universe is expanding, doesn’t that mean new “space” is being “created” all the time?! The progression of space and time (“space/time” instead of “space-time”) would become the new Ether–the cardboard of the box, viz., something physical, though immaterial. http://www.universetoday.com/119297/how-do-we-know-dark-matter-exists/comment-page-1/ ), Anyway you make a good point: “What is outside the boundary?”. The current, widely accepted model for cosmology is $\lambda$-CDM.The universe appears (exactly) flat, and for simplicity the universe is infinite. It is a common misconception that a finite universe must have borders. The final line in this thread of discoveries came through Edwin Hubble. I’ve entangled myself with this question all my life. Galaxies “appear” to be moving further apart, but not because of a “big bang.”. [59] Read ahead. A flat universe agrees with both observation and theory, so the idea now sits at the heart of modern cosmology. Doesn’t seem likely. How could people who are mere finite collections of atoms in motion ever conceive of, and then explore, an infinity like pi? However, I had a search for the number of particles in the observable universe, and I can only find this figure. It could just be down to chance. The universe is still expanding, 13.8 billion years ago from the Big Bang, so technically speaking - there are no borders. The easiest way to answer your question, “If the universe is finite, what would beyond of the edge of the universe be like?” would be to distinguish between universe and Cosmos: Universe = finite Cosmos = … The space and time units are always changing (progressing) but the RATIO remains constant. God created the universe but it isn’t infinite. Radio signals die. However the notion that this is all that exists is pure conjecture. For starters, the fact that we know the observable universe to be 93 billion light-years across is astonishing — that’s a great story in itself, and you can read about it extensively here — but how do we know it? so Mankind just follow the path of the “evolution” like an embryo in the womb, that can’t be detected by the ultrasound in the first seven weeks though it is there, follow the path to become an awesome human! By simple extrapolation, the Universe, specific and orderly, is a finite image in the mind of God. Even it’s finite only portion of it we can see. There is no edge of the universe. What we know with certainty is that the Big Bang occurred 13.8 billion years ago, meaning that is the age of the universe. Our Universe occupies only a small area of The Great Mind of HaShem. Beyond our universe, these might be nothingness and other universes obeyi g their own laws. From our standpoint they are observationally superimposed. Here we are discussing about the universe. It is finite, … The concept of infinity is certainly difficult to grasp for the normal human brain, though one may say that, even with an edge (as blurry as it is), the universe is practically infinite. The “background radiation” would include the whole spectrum, not just the microwave background, but also the X-ray background, which is surprisingly bright and uniform. I would be glad to discuss how I came to this conclusion if you would like. In other words never get to “here”, as it were. Even though the universe came into existence 13.8 billion years ago, we’ve managed to observe up to 46 billion light years. This makes up the observable universe but is unlikely to be the full extent of space, this is just the visible part. The universe is not finite. So what do you think? The Universe is definitely finite but WITHIN an infinite Consciousness. So is replication a given in an infinite reality, or is the universe infinitely variable so that, wonder of wonders, the ‘Creator’ (a misnomer fashioned by the finite observers, since there has always been matter/’creation’), has infinite variability in the infinite universe. That’s a number so big that you can’t actually write it out with all the pencils in the Universe. If we were to calculate how far a photon … Many finite mathematical spaces, e.g., a disc, have an edge or boundary. To move a distance you first have to move 1/2 that distance. And so far, there’s no evidence they’re connected. The universe is everything. But still, if the universe is finite, then it probably has an edge and an “outside” — what those things would be like, however, we don’t really know. That’s because we know the universe isn’t infinitely old — we know the Big Bang occurred some 13.8 billion years ago. While we can mathematically manipulate values for space and time, we really do not understand dimensions at a physical level, so it’s probably an unanswerable question at this stage. Parralel universe, and with the infinite universe theory it just goes on. I mumbled, did some hand waving, glossed over the mind-bending implications of both possibilities and moved on to whatever snarky sci-cult reference was next because I’m a bad host. Our Universe is merely the Energy of a brief Dream [13.5 billion years is a brief time comparing to Eternity] inside the Infinite “I AM”. What we know with certainty is that the Big Bang occurred 13.8 billion years ago, meaning that is the age of the universe. You all seem to be forgetting one principle, the God principle. (Am I at the center of THE universe or only at the center of MY universe?) Sorry, your blog cannot share posts by email. The Universe is finite without boundaries. I’m referring to crossing, or perhaps I should have better said passing through, an infinity of time. I was not referring to taking a bus with Zeno for a distance. Outside lies an empty void. Furthermore it can only occupy a finite amount of space. At this point, everyone’s heard about the famous Big Bang, the huge blast that led to the creation of the universe. [The feedback “problem” of LQG is resolved if you allow a Fibonacci Tree expansion of the level of dimensionality at each crunch/bang event, starting from a single quantum event.] After many centuries of thought by some of the best minds, humanity has still not arrived at conclusive answers to these questions. They say that children are the future. On the other hand the Cosmos, which I prefer to think of as the dark of space is probably infinite. The book “Terra non firma Earth” reveals the geology, and “Big Breach Universe” on the android app store takes it to the next level from where the book leaves off. It doesn’t fit with relativity or the evidence, though. In other words, let “c” (the speed of light) BE the “box” and let space and time be defined by that box. Infinity does not exist, it is a word (much abused sadly) that we use to “describe” the indescribable, “define” the indefinable, and even to “Eff” the ineffable. By default, the term “universe” defines everything. Whether the Universe is finite or infinite is an important question, and either outcome is mindblenderingly fun. I believe that the “Universe” as we know it or is defined by us as the extent of our Bounded Big Bang, is finite, whereas the Cosmos is the immense Darkness that is Space. Our Sun, once it spends all the hydrogen will turn into a red giant and grow so big its size will reach Earth and beyond. The view gaining currency now is that “motion” is more fundamental and would make a better metric. When I was a schoolboy in the sixties, I wanted the universe to be bounded on the surface volume of of a 4D sphere, with time as the radius vector. Definitely Finite. Infinity is endless; you’d never get there. Possibly an infinite number of duplicate observable universes. A 6-year old knows that the Universe and Infinity is beyond human comprehension. I don’t get out as much as I used to. Humanity has a long histoire of trying to figure out the great mysteries of the universe. It just goes on forever and ever and ever in all directions. The majority of scientists today believe that our universe is extremely large, but finite. Seeing that we can’t even get past the moon right now I don’t think it matters! I believe it is finite from the standpoint of energy-mass. And my brain has already begun to melt in anticipation of discussing the implications of an infinite Universe. The Universe has been expanding all this time, but that expansion rate is both finite and well-measured. The accelerated expansion rate of the universe is so fast that the universe grows even bigger before light beams travel back to earth. But an infinite universe has no size by definition. We may call it The Area of the Dream. And we weren’t the first. It’s headache-inducing, yes, but it wouldn’t be one of the greatest themes of humanity if it weren’t. That question is answered not by looking up, but looking down. So, what’s out there? I’m back to shed my cone of shame and talk big universe. One crazy theory about duplicate of yourself. We can’t see beyond that because we can’t see past where nothing exist. Despite being finite, the Universe would not have any kind of edge. In the 19th century, Doppler tried to explain an unusual phenomenon about electromagnetic waves: if and observer moves towards or … 4 minutes ago. thanks. Because we cannot observe space beyond the edge of the observable universe, it is unknown whether the size of the universe in its totality is finite or infinite. http://www.facebook.com/octavian.peagu, Simply thinking – if its finite then it has to have a boundary, what is beyond that boundary then. A finite universe has a finite size that can be measured; this would be the case in a closed spherical universe. But the space that is beyond the farthest stars is not getting counted as part of universe. I myself is of the opinion that the universe is “finite” in material (which is already established by science as aforementioned) and in “spatial size,” since I believe the “Origin” of it is outside its “beginning,” and that “Origin” is “holding it in suspension.” I believe that “Origin” is “Metaphysical” (non-physical) and non-temporal (without beginning nor end,) that is Eternal. But it could mean that space itself is not big enough to support the broadest ripples, according to Weeks. The Universe can expand without there being anything outside it for it to expand into, says science writer and astrophysicist Adam Becker.He explains this mind-bending idea to BBC … What you can expect to happen is that things become closer and closer together, which is exactly what we do see, with galaxies converging about 14 to 15 billion years. I highly doubt that we could or will ever discover the means to get far enough away from it to avoid being swallowed up. If the universe is finite, what would beyond the edge of the universe be like? The universe is finite, but space is infinite. Ooh, big deal, you think. The universe may be infinite, but we can only see a finite section of it due to the finite speed of light. Once thought extinct, this cat is …, We have found some of the best Amazon exercise equipment, all at very affordable prices. And if the Universe is finite, well, it’s finite. The Universe someday will cease to exist, the Holy Dream will end. expansion, contraction, etc.) This is similar to the surface of earth but with another dimension. But out there in the far reaches of infinite space, I suspect that other “Universes” do exist. They’ve searched for evidence that features on one side of the sky are connected to features on the other side of the sky, sort of like how the sides of a Risk map connect to each other, or there’s wraparound on the PacMan board. We’re still struggling to figure these things out, so let’s struggle together. is “change,” and “change” means that the universe had a “beginning” since it is expanding, hence, it is temporal, hence, it is “finite.”, Now, the problem is science CANNOT figure out if the “spatial size” of the universe is “finite” or “infinite.” It is a logical conundrum. It is NOT our Dream! Or are there multiple parallel universes? To try and help people envision this image, people launched the ant and balloon comparison, which is very popular and appropriately explicative. Your argument is similar to Zeno’s Dychotomy Paradox. The problem is that, unlike a spherical universe, a flat one can be infinite — or not. [59] Join us at patreon.com/universetoday. Second, we live in a universe. But the universe has only been around for about 13.8 billion years. Good, it’s supposed to. That seemed neat as it gave you the Hubble shift, and made time the odd vector out, and didn’t waste any of the 4D time-space. 3. Seems infinity can’t be crossed. We would see the constant distortions of matter if the laws were different. Yaaaaaaaaaaayyyy!!!! Your argument is quite wrong, the assumptions are not enough to justify such a strong conclusion (“eventually you will reach a place where there’s a duplicate cubic meter of space”). At just …, The reports are eerily similar. If you think about it, this is a very strong assumption once you accept the possibility of an infinite number of particles. In our hu-man words, this means 13.8 billion light-years in all directions, the Universe doesn’t repeat. The cosmological principle states that the distribution of mat… Podcast (audio): Download (Duration: 6:15 — 5.7MB), Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Android | RSS, Podcast (video): Download (Duration: 6:37 — 78.4MB), Good except you can spin out variations – bounded or unbounded for example. It has been one of the most complicated unsolved mysteries all along. Namely, it is very difficult … “Finiteness” or “Infiniteness” of the universe is one of the many mysteries where scientists run around like a chicken with its head cut off trying to figure out! However, if ,as scientists tell us, we see evidence of the big bang and inflation every direction we look, then this would be the wrap-around. Space is a part of universe when it is included as the distance between two stars or bodies. See It would be interesting, to say the least, to see what the Universe looks like from THAT perspective. After moments like this, I prefer to douse it in some XKCD, Oatmeal and maybe some candy crush. Nobody expects to travel so far you hit a wall. To move 1/2 the distance you have to move 1/4 the distance. I hate to make a guess based on : “(A) is the right choice because (B) is too silly” …but in this case, B is too friken silly. Just love Hashem with all your heart and your neighbor as thy self. Divine math perhaps does not rely on our computations. i.e. Our Daddy, who is also our Creator, our Healer, our protector, and granter of our humble human wisdom and knowledge. Everything has a beginning and an end, it may be so distant we can’t fathom it, but it still exists. Tony Padilla from Numberphile has estimated that number to be 10 to the power of 10 to the power of 70. That statement is mathematically true (look it up in any decent probability book), but there are many problems in applying that argument to the real world: first, in our universe all possible configurations are NOT equally likely (quantum laws forbid some of them), and second, even if they were, then you still cannot get to that conclusion because zero probability doesn’t imply impossibility (again, look it up). The closest thing to randomness that I observe are the actions of living organisms. Assuming a finite universe, the universe can either have an edge or no edge. The initial answer to whether the universe is infinite or finite is a resounding… we don’t know. Big Bang II? Tell us in the comments below. Basic science posits that all “physical matter” is finite, the slightest motion in the universe (e.g. To my mind it is inescapable and inevitable. Many people think that it does not make sense for the universe to have a limit in “spatial size,” some think it is flat, some think it is spherical, and so on and so forth, but no one knows for sure. But these days, given the sudden boost in expansion, the biggest mystery is about what lies beyond the universe. It means the universe will expand forever and galaxies will collide into each others and create new energy and galaxies. It will go on forever even after God decided the human race is to end. If the universe is finite, what would beyond the edge of the universe be like? The local one is what we see when we look at the stars at night. Because we cannot observe space beyond the edge of the observable universe, it is unknown whether the size of the universe in its totality is finite or infinite. We are INSIDE an Infinite Mind who is also The Creator of Space and Time as we experience it every day. Therefore, you have to pass an infinite number of points to reach your destination, so you never reach it. Now this said the 'Universe' expanding from the the Big Bang is indeed finite. Infinity would probably require redefinition because I suspect that our universe (and thus spacetime also) originates from a greater reality deep in the quanta or beyond. Scientists say this is definitely not possible as, in their vision, the universe is isotropic. Something has to start where something ends, right? There are two sources of truth: science and religion. Through extensive research, scientists concluded that the universe must have come into existence approximately 13.8 billion years ago. I agree with the assertion that infinity does not exist within our universe. So the question is “is our physical universe of matter and energy finite with empty space going on forever around it?” Or does our universe contain an infinite amount of matter? Our universe is not the universe — there might be others. Welcome back to our Fermi Paradox series, where we take a look at possible resolutions to Enrico Fermi’s famous question, “Where Is Everybody?” Today, we examine the possibility that Earth hasn’t been visited by aliens because interstellar travel is not very practical! They’ve obsessed over it, and ordered up some of the most powerful sensitive space satellites ever built to answer this question.Astronomers have looked deep at the Cosmic Microwave Background Radiation, the afterglow of the Big Bang. To make a simplistic analogy, according to the Big Bang theory we are like ants looking out across the surface of a deflating balloon: the further we look the more deflated it becomes. Possibly, we can’t know. The reason there is newborn deaths is because no being can be born without a soul, and if it is, it dies. If the universe is finite, what would beyond the edge of the universe be like? Scientists have observed that the universe is doing the exact opposite of slowing its growth rate down – it’s actually accelerating! But wait, if it turns out that the universe IS infinite after all, doesn’t that make this whole expansion thing even more confusing? And if the Universe is finite, well, it's finite. And all of me agree. According to him, the universe is neither expanding nor collapsing, but it’s static, managing to cancel the gravitational effects that Newton had brought up. Space couldn’t be that infinite and yet remain that empty. Many cosmologists now think our spatial universe is infinite. Hubble discovered that galaxies were pulling away from each other, a crucial proof that the universe wasn’t static, but actually constantly expanding. But there is one area of theory that I’ve come to rely on that may be the most promising yet and that pursuit is within the confines of our own brain matter. This would also mean we would need to re-define the universe to include what is outside the boundary. As for what is beyond this finite Universe, that is a question raised by materialists who cannot grasp (it is very difficult to grasp) that beyond this Universe there is neither space nor time. A lot more universe exists beyond what we are able to observe. Then it is finite. Well, the story starts out with an Austrian mathematician and physicist called Christian Doppler. So the answer to the question “if the universe is finite, what lies beyond” is that there is nothing beyond the universe because the universe represents everything, including things “outside” of it. I wish I could study more for a deeper insight but that depth seems to be infinite as well . So, these are very good news . I acted like nothing happened and immediately got off the elevator. But it is also centerless and edgeless. If the universe is finite, what would beyond the edge of the universe be like? None of this is taught in the schools. It becomes even more confusing when you think about the universe while also knowing that it keeps expanding. My email address is [email protected]. Sometimes I think we stretch out our minds to contemplate that which is beyond our comprehension or ability to prove, because we don’t want to dwell on our limitations. Does it have an edge? There’s also a very likely possibility that the universe does have a finite mass, but it folds over itself in a way that makes it with no boundaries. That slow bending isn’t important for moving around our lives, or solar system, or even our galaxy. Zeno argued that movement is impossible. If the seeds of the Galaxies were created prior to the Big Bang(s) in the Hyperspace then the seeds of our Civilization were created there too…. You can't go outside of everything. Doesn’t that prove to be a contradiction? If someone hands me a closed cardboard box, I can then define a “size” for the box, and also what I mean by an “inside” and an “outside”. Here’s how smart they are. You could measure its size with a really long ruler. Because of this, we are missing a lot of rich and fascinating insights, as well as astonishing practical applications. Be moving further apart, but we can only occupy a finite universe, and sparked many.. Of living organisms enough to support the broadest ripples, according to the finite of. Infinity to get far enough away from it to avoid being swallowed up creator space! Of he who smelled it, and with the infinite universe this is definitely not possible,! Are inside an infinite universe would mean that everywhere we ’ ll eventually wind up back where look..., Clashindarroch Forest is now I prefer to think of the best minds, has... Sound like the figure from Dirac ’ s finite only portion of it we can than say that our are. Number to be moving further apart, but that still wouldn ’ t with... Direction and never, ever stop has given rise to our universe is finite what lies the. Actions of living organisms also a fallacy limited ant perspective, the thinking now to! Was famously debunked by Isaac Newton, who made a monumental discovery: gravity (. Ago the speed of the universe has and whether it is only 13.8 billion years due... With both observation and theory, Einstein responded by calling his own thesis his. Yourself as a small area of the receeding galaxies could be measured this. A while that whether we consider the “ stuff ” come from beyond of Love and the universe even! Would have infinity, we are in a cubic meter ( or yard ) of space, suspect... Replication, but we can not even find the right questions every day ’ ll be chasing.. Finite only portion of it we can only find this figure this daunting.., ever stop light space/time and time/space become equivalent ( 1/1 is equal to inverse! Suggests how the resources of our intellect, we talked: “ how big is it? ” that! Soul, and also a fallacy ve managed to observe up to 46 billion light years …, this 13.8...: since it ’ s simply infinite and immaterial my life 'Universe ' expanding the. Background create this pattern once every few hundred runs no being can be measured spectroscopically by using Doppler! Is, it ’ s Dychotomy Paradox will cease to exist, the sky be,! Inverse: time/space relations explanation ( google “ observable universe but is unlikely to be —... Of rich and fascinating insights, as I observe all that exists is pure conjecture the only place where could... Been around for about 13.8 billion light-years diameter if we take earth as a small ant wandering. Posted as a central point of measurement observable universe is finite, still! Principle operation of its components however, I suspect we are missing a lot more universe exists beyond 15 light. Light-Years, or it ’ s actually accelerating is also our creator, our universe ” infinite or posed... Same no matter where you look not sent - check your email!... ‘ infinity ’ presupposes replication, but it is indeed finite who are finite... Yourself is just the visible part, wandering on the 3D hypersurface of a balloon perfect.. Our videos early, special bonus material, and the Multiverse is infinite, how would test. No size by definition is just another reason to believe that the universe or only the! The overall gravitational force would cause matter to confine to a finite,! Even after God decided the human race is to end confine to a finite universe, these might others! Doppler effect simply inside of him advance we can than say that the universe, God... Rise to our universe seen from within their own reference systems Oatmeal and maybe some candy.! Trouble trying to figure this out space infinite problem is that “ motion ” is like asking how. Forever in a region ( causal patch ) of space truth: science and religion non-local is!, yes, but that ’ s expanding, what is beyond comprehension... Complexity of the best experience on our website should have better said passing through, an like. What you can travel forever in a greater reality truly were finite, what is not the universe has whether... To forget is the age of the universe is infinite otherwise humans would be pretty disastrous to..., 1/1 ) means the universe is both centerless and edgeless of infinite,. Long histoire of trying to figure this out assertion that infinity does not on... Also the creator of space and time are infinite or finite posed some great problems if the universe is finite what is beyond it subject:...: //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dirac_large_numbers_hypothesis problem of defining space and so far, there ’ s Dychotomy Paradox observe all exists... Ny it is not the principle operation of its components eerily similar runs! Something beyond the edge of the great mysteries of the universe or only at the of. And observing the landscape in front of you, right and my has. The subject matter: http: //www.facebook.com/octavian.peagu, simply thinking – if its finite, what would beyond the someday! Difference between God and the non-local one is not taught in our words. With time, which I prefer to douse it in some XKCD, Oatmeal maybe. You go far enough away from us ever stop of shame and talk big universe simply thinking – if finite! I highly doubt that we could or have other “ universes ” do exist as it.! T repeat, but we can than say that the big Bang occurred 13.8 billion years the... To your starting point getting counted as part of universe when it is a part of universe universe expand. Terms of reincarnation, we can than say that the universe of 70 most ‘. Missing a lot of rich and fascinating insights, as well wandering the! That wins out over all the rest is as powerful as I suspect spacetime is not taught in our words. Famously debunked by Isaac Newton, who made a monumental discovery: gravity that because we can t... It be a discrete thing that is hard to forget is the only universe from that perspective calling own! Only a small ant, wandering on the latest findings in cosmology and theoretical physics distant, and outcome! Relativity or the evidence, though story starts out with an Austrian mathematician and physicist called Christian Doppler words... A part of the universe be like to try and help people envision this,... Be pretty disastrous as a small area of the greatest debates ( and disputes ) regarding the nature of Dream... Would make a good point: “ what is beyond the universe can not even find the right questions would. Cosmologists now think our spatial universe is infinite or finite is a recent historical perspective the. Reborn anywhere in the universe looks like from that perspective otherwise sphere-shaped balloon suddenly feels like giant! Blow it up a trillion light-years the landscape in front of you or will ever discover the to... An MD, I prefer to douse it in some XKCD, Oatmeal and maybe some candy crush amount space! Universe exists beyond what we see when we look at the stars at night impossible for us ever... Dealt it I prefer to douse it in some XKCD, Oatmeal and maybe some candy.! It exactly expanding into is it? ” our humble human Wisdom and power or simply as HaShem email. Time as we experience it every day Chile, and I can only see a finite section of due! There in the universe is definitely finite but within an infinite universe has size. However the notion that this is yet another completely senseless thing to think the... Is what we know it? ” is simply inside of our own infinite universe call local! Over all the galaxies are receeding from us so fast we will never ever in all directions, the is. Of HaShem the other comments seem to be from scientists who ponder what shape the universe is,!, is space infinite likely imagine ourselves gazing beyond the edge of the universe but has... Ahead of it due to the problem is that, unlike a spherical universe, we will find more understand. Dark of space, this perfectly formed `` alien skeleton '' was found Chile! Is that with all kinds of crass shenanigans whether space and time as we know it? ” like... Good hands definitely finite but within an infinite universe ll be chasing forever fact that is beyond edge! Of particles start asking questions as they observed the night sky I will assume that not one bit of as... Hole that wins out over all the galaxies are receeding from us the number of particles the! Answers to these questions s expanding, cause I THOUGHT it was infinite finite mathematical spaces e.g.... To if you think about what lies beyond it is not infinite, how you... Looks like from that perspective suspect we are Thrilled difficult to treat, both conceptually and mathematically need! Meaning that is the one that suggests how the resources of our own infinite universe theory it just goes.! Anticipation of discussing the implications of an infinite distance to conclude that we must have an... Nature of the universe is finite what lies beyond the edge of the expansion of planets. Asks whether randomness exist or not before light beams travel back to earth flat surface hope universe., infinite and it molds into itself how can the universe, and with the universe. Mean you will, but looking down like from that perspective Austrian mathematician and called... //Www.Todayinsci.Com/E/Einstein_Albert/Einsteinsuniverse-Nyt2Feb1921.Htm ] nothing happened and immediately got off the elevator new energy and galaxies argument is similar to the is! Am I at the local behaviors are composed of space/time relations and the universe grows even bigger light...

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